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  • Help to translate Måltidssång by Bellman

    Ons 25 nov 2020 11:09 Läst 0 gånger Totalt 18 svar
    Ons 25 nov 2020 11:09

    I am translating Maltidssang to Russian. I have translated all but I can not understand the next:
    Och du, som med en ärlig min
    Plär dina vänner häda jämt
    Och dem förtalar vid ditt vin,
    Och det liksom på skämt,
    Och du, som ej försvarar dem,
    Fästän ur deras flaskor, du,
    Du väl kan slicka dina fem,
    Vad svarar du väl nu?

    I understand all words but I can not understand the phrases. Can you explain me please? 


    TRÅDSTARTARENS TILLÄGGSKOMMENTAR 2020-11-25 11:21
    I unerstand that Fästän must be replaced by Fastän. I need to understand whole text. Why somebody can "slicka fem"? "Slicka" the vine from bottles? Why?

    Also I can not fully understand the phrase

    Och sen med en ovänlig min
    Ryck remmaren ur hans trut!

    In particular, I can not understand the sentence "Ryck remmaren ur hans trut". Is it idiomatic phrase? What is the meaning of it?

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 11:36 #1

    A remmare is a rummer in English, a large drinking-glass with prunts to facilitate holding. 

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 11:42 #2 +1
    AlexanderFionov skrev 2020-11-25 11:09:08 följande:

    I am translating Maltidssang to Russian. I have translated all but I can not understand the next:

    Och du, som med en ärlig minPlär dina vänner häda jämtOch dem förtalar vid ditt vin,Och det liksom på skämt,Och du, som ej försvarar dem,Fästän ur deras flaskor, du,Du väl kan slicka dina fem,Vad svarar du väl nu?

    I understand all words but I can not understand the phrases. Can you explain me please? 

    TRÅDSTARTARENS TILLÄGGSKOMMENTAR 2020-11-25 11:21

    I unerstand that Fästän must be replaced by Fastän. I need to understand whole text. Why somebody can "slicka fem"? "Slicka" the vine from bottles? Why?

    Also I can not fully understand the phrase

    Och sen med en ovänlig min

    Ryck remmaren ur hans trut!

    In particular, I can not understand the sentence "Ryck remmaren ur hans trut". Is it idiomatic phrase? What is the meaning of it?


    "Slicka fem" means "lick your fingers". Or, in other words, clean your hand.

    I would translate the phrase "ryck remmaren ur hans trut" to "grab the rummer from his mouth". Meaning is denying someone to drink in a very physical way.
  • Ons 25 nov 2020 11:43 #3 +1

    So perhaps:
    And then with a harsh expression
    snatch the glass from his gob (i e to stop him from drinking more)

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 12:25 #4 +1
    FtS70 skrev 2020-11-25 11:43:12 följande:

    So perhaps:

    And then with a harsh expression

    snatch the glass from his gob (i e to stop him from drinking more)


    I think I could live with that

    It's bloody hard to translate elderly swedish lyrics - I've tried with O holy night, and I'm still working on it
  • Ons 25 nov 2020 12:29 #5 +1

    Och du, som med en ärlig min

    Plär dina vänner häda jämt

    Och dem förtalar vid ditt vin,

    Och det liksom på skämt,

    Och du, som ej försvarar dem,

    Fästän ur deras flaskor, du,

    Du väl kan slicka dina fem,

    Vad svarar du väl nu?

    And you, who with a straight/honest face

    Always talk badly about your friends (häda actually means blaspheme but I couldn't put that into a sentence that made sense)

    And slander them while you drink your wine

    Like it is a joke

    And you, who don't defend them

    Even though (you drink) from their bottles, you

    You can lick your fingers (I think the meaning here is that you gladly eat their food)

    What do you answer? (Or What do you have to say for yourself?)

    So the whole verse is about people taking advantage of friends and not being nice to them, and the singer is questioning their actions.

    As a side note, even Swedish people have a hard time understanding Bellman word for word because the language has evolved a lot from his days.

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 15:55 #6

    Thank you very much for explanations!
    I want to translate Maltidssang equirhythmically into Russian so that to sing it on Russian using original melody. I have already translated several songs, and you can see my translations on the page stihi.ru/avtor/fionov&book=1#1
    Also I published them on my FB page, together with figures, made by a professional painter. I plan to publish a book. 
    And now I have translated almost all Maltidssang, but without one this fragment. 
    Concerning remmare and trut, I have correctly understood the meaning, thank you for explanation!

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 21:06 #7

    Concerning the phrase "Plär dina vänner häda jämt"
    Is it correct, that "
    Plär" means "Plägar"
    Like "tar" means "tagar"?
    Answer, please!  It is very interesting!

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 21:18 #8 +1

    Pravilno, can not write Cyrillic on my device.

  • Ons 25 nov 2020 21:34 #9 +1
    AlexanderFionov skrev 2020-11-25 21:06:55 följande:

    Concerning the phrase "Plär dina vänner häda jämt"

    Is it correct, that "Plär" means "Plägar"

    Like "tar" means "tagar"?

    Answer, please!  It is very interesting!


    Yes, it's probably abbreviated to fit the verse, or it's an older version of the word. It means "to be in the habit of (doing something)".
  • Tor 26 nov 2020 10:33 #10

    Thank you very much for all! I have completed the translation! It is interesting that the word "remmare" is absent in dictionaries. And I have reconsidered the sence of the phrase
    Du, vid din remmare och press
    Rödbrusig och med hatt på sned,

    I thought that "press" means a device for printing books and the phrase is about the press worker. But he is an drinker, not the worker. And I changed my translation according to new meaning.

  • Tor 26 nov 2020 10:36 #11

    I have translated Sma grodorna also, and this picture is for you. 

  • Tor 26 nov 2020 11:34 #12 +1
    AlexanderFionov skrev 2020-11-26 10:33:59 följande:

    Thank you very much for all! I have completed the translation! It is interesting that the word "remmare" is absent in dictionaries. And I have reconsidered the sence of the phrase

    Du, vid din remmare och pressRödbrusig och med hatt på sned,

    I thought that "press" means a device for printing books and the phrase is about the press worker. But he is an drinker, not the worker. And I changed my translation according to new meaning.


    Yes "press" is referring to a wine press, and he's not working but drinking from it.
  • Tor 26 nov 2020 20:40 #13

    This is my translation of Maltidssang into Russian
    stihi.ru/2020/11/26/9123
    Thanks to all your messages! It was very helpful!

  • Fre 27 nov 2020 06:57 #14 +1
    BuoBä skrev 2020-11-26 11:34:19 följande:

    Yes "press" is referring to a wine press, and he's not working but drinking from it.


    Maybe both, drinking while working was quite common in those days
  • Fre 27 nov 2020 15:00 #15

    I think that a press is necessary for juice preparation. Then juice has to be transformed to vine. So, there is no vine directly from the press. But testing the ready vine is reasonable. 

  • Fre 27 nov 2020 15:52 #16
    AlexanderFionov skrev 2020-11-27 15:00:59 följande:

    I think that a press is necessary for juice preparation. Then juice has to be transformed to vine. So, there is no vine directly from the press. But testing the ready vine is reasonable. 


    I doubt there was much wine production in Sweden, so it's probably more to evoke the image of a heavy drinker. And decadence.
  • Fre 27 nov 2020 16:15 #17

    Thank you for your advice. I can not draw pictures myself, I asked professional painter to do this for money. Now this work has been completed. Maybe in the future I shall ask the painter to draw a picture for Maltidssang, if my book project will be commercially successful.

  • Fre 27 nov 2020 16:26 #18

    Good luck with your book!

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