Fred i Ukraina

Energiberoendet är en del av de politiska målen med integration och ömsesidig nytta för bägge parter. I ett försök att integrera Ryssland med väst om och om igen gjordes handelsavtal och samarbeten, inte olikt det Vance och Trump säger att de vill göra för att skapa fred.

Det har misslyckats och kommer att misslyckas igen. 

Nedrustningen efter kalla krigets slut och de stora ekonomiska kriserna från 2000 och framåt är sett i spegeln en missräkning.

Acceptera kapitaluation? Europa ska ju öka stödet nu?

Det var ju det jag sa. OM det blir krig.

Trumps tre krav för fortsatta samtal: Ursäkt, mineraler och fredssamtal

Man anser inte alls. Man säger att enligt Ukrainas krigslagar/konstitution så FÅR man inte ha val under pågående krig. Om USA har liknande lagar så kommer det inte att bli några val, annars så blir det val enligt de lagar som finns.

'AmerExit'? Republicans push for US to leave NATO amid stalled Ukraine peace negotiations | Fox News

Allt militärt stöd från USA till Ukraina är pausat från och med idag, som svar på Zelenskyjs dåliga beteende och otacksamhet.

Snarare vad Trump/Vance inbillat sig av Zelenskyjs beteende.

Vi som håller oss till fakta vet att detta inte är sant.

Vid en genomgång fann man (media) minst 33 tillfällen då Zelenskyj uttryckt tacksamhet till USA, USA's president (och andra representanter han mött) och det amerikanska folket i offentliga tal, på sociala medier och vid möten med amerikanska representanter. Ord som thanks, thank you och gratitude förekommer inte sällan flera gånger vid dessa tillfällen.
Då letade man enbart efter skriftliga och muntliga meddelanden på engelska. 

Transkription av den tv-sända delen av samtalen mellan Zelinskyj, Trump och Vance i ovala rummet i fredags:

J.D. Vance: For four years, in the United States of America, we had a president who stood up in press conferences and talked tough about Vladimir Putin, and then Putin invaded Ukraine and destroyed a significant chunk of the country. The path to peace and the path to prosperity is maybe engaging in diplomacy. We tried the pathway of Joe Biden, of thumping our chest and pretending that the president of the United States? words mattered more than the president of the United States? actions. What makes America a good country is America engaging in diplomacy. That?s what President Trump is doing.

Volodymyr Zelensky: He [Putin] occupied various parts of Ukraine in 2014. During that time, it was President Obama, then President Trump, then President Biden, and now it?s President Trump and he will stop him [Putin]. But during 2014, nobody stopped him. He just occupied and took. He killed people. From 2014 till 2022, the situation was the same?people have been dying on the contact line and nobody stopped him. We had a lot of conversations with him, including a bilateral conversation. As a new president in 2019, I signed with him a cease-fire deal alongside Macron and Merkel. All of them told me that he will never go. We also signed a gas contract with him. But after all of that, he broke the cease-fire. He killed our people, and he didn?t exchange prisoners. We signed the exchange of prisoners, but he didn?t do it. What kind of diplomacy, J.D., are you speaking about? What do you mean?

Vance: I?m talking about the kind of diplomacy that?s going to end the destruction of your country. [Zelensky begins to respond] Mr. President, with respect, I think it?s disrespectful for you to come to the Oval Office and try to litigate this in front of the American media. Right now, you guys are going around and forcing conscripts to the front lines because you have manpower problems?you should be thanking the president for trying to bring an end to this conflict.

Zelensky: Have you ever been to Ukraine to see what problems we have? Come once.

Vance: I?ve actually watched and seen the stories, and I know what happens is you bring people on a propaganda tour, Mr. President. Do you disagree that you?ve had problems bringing people in your military, and do you think that it?s respectful to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country?

Zelensky: First of all, during the war, everybody has problems, even you. But you have a nice ocean and don?t feel [the problems] now. But you will feel it in the future.

Donald Trump: You don?t know that.

Zelensky: God bless, you will not have war.

Trump: Don?t tell us what we?re going to feel. We?re trying to solve a problem.

Zelensky: I?m not. I?m answering the question that?

Trump: You?re in no position to dictate what we?re going to feel. We?re going to feel very good.

Zelensky: You are going to feel influenced?

Trump: We?re going to feel very good and very strong. You?re, right now, not in a very good position. You?ve allowed yourself to be in a very bad position. You don?t have the cards right now with us. [Zelensky continues speaking] You?re gambling with the lives of millions of people. You?re gambling with World War Three. You?re gambling with World War Three, and what you?re doing is very disrespectful to this country that?s backed you far more than a lot of people say they should have.

Vance: Have you said thank you once?

Zelensky: A lot of times.

Vance: No, in this entire meeting, have you said thank you? You went to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October. Offer some words of appreciation for the United States of America and the president who?s trying to save your country.

Zelensky: Please, you think that if you will speak very loudly?

Trump: He is not speaking loudly. Your country is in big trouble.

Zelensky: I know. Can I ask?

Trump: No, no, you?ve done a lot of talking. Your country is in big trouble.

Zelensky: I know.

Trump: You?re not winning this. You have a damn good chance of coming out okay because of us.

Zelensky: Mr. President, we are staying strong in our country. From the very beginning of the war we?ve been alone and we are thankful. I said thank you in this cabinet.

Trump: We gave you, through this stupid president, $350 billion. We gave you military equipment. Your men are brave but they have used our military equipment. If you didn?t have our military equipment, this war would have been over in two weeks.

Zelensky: In three days, yes. I heard it from Putin.

Trump: It?s going to be a very hard thing to do business like this.

Vance: Just say thank you.

Zelensky: I said thank you?I say thank you to the American people.

Vance: Accept that there are disagreements, and let?s go litigate those disagreements, rather than trying to fight it out in the American media, when you?re wrong. We know that you?re wrong.

Trump: You see, I think it?s good for the American people to see what?s going on. I think it?s very important. That?s why I kept this going so long. You have to be thankful. You don?t have the cards. You?re buried there. You people are dying. You?re running low on soldiers. Listen, you?re running low on soldiers. It would be a damn good thing. Then you tell us, ?I don?t want to cease fire. I don?t want to cease fire.? If you could get a cease-fire right now, I tell you, you take it so the bullets stop flying and your men stop getting killed.

Zelensky: Yes, of course I want to stop the war. But, as I?ve said to you, with guarantees. Ask our people about the cease-fire, what do they think.

 

Trump: That wasn?t me. That was with a guy named Biden, who was not a smart person. That was with Obama, who gave you sheets. I gave you javelins. I gave you the javelins to take out all those tanks. Obama gave you sheets. In fact, the statement is Obama gave sheets and Trump gave javelins. You got to be more thankful, because, let me tell you, you don?t have the cards. With us, you have the cards, but without us, you don?t have any cards. It?ll be a tough deal to make because the attitudes have to change.

För att sätta det i perspektiv. Det frysta stödet är för utrustning motsvarande  en miljard dollar varav en tredjedel redan är i Ukraina och inte kan stoppas. 

Det ger att runt 650 miljoner dollar stoppas.

Det motsvara enligt tidigare amerikanska stödpaket ungefär 45-50 stridsvagnar.
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Alltså inte överdrivet mycket i det korta perspektivet men en tydlig politisk markering från USA som man nu måste förhandla sig ur från Europeiskt och ukrainskt håll.